Tuesday, November 10, 2009

Something is wrong.

Trying to figure out what this feel of self-deception is.

What I'm hiding from myself.

Edging towards it.

Dinner on Sunday, with the new guy.

I picked the place. Luna Park, on the corner of Wilshire and La Brea. My wish to go was due to the title resemblence to Easton Ellis' Lunar Park that I loved so well.

Stepped in the door. Red. Everything was red. Chandeliers, dark wood tables, votives, odd, probably local, art. Assessed. Two male hosts at the front desk.

Took charge.

Quick smile, told them the number of diners. Bantered, joked, flirted without intent.

My date followed me, saying little.

We sit. His back to the door. I don't like not being able to see who is coming in behind me, makes me uneasy.

But I had no view, and could not see the small mass of people at my back.

So we switched seats. My suggestion, my control.

Waiter came by. One of the hosts, actually. He put us in his small serving area.

Menus received, more laughter, more jokes and teasing.

Water was ordered by me.
An alcoholic beverage by my date. One of several strikes against him. Not because he was drinking, I could care less, but because awareness of your partner is key, and he knew I did not drink, though he didn't know why. I could have been fresh out of AA and seeing him drink could have been a bad, bad thing. He didn't care, or didn't think to care.

Lazy and careless.

Waiter returns.

Date is waffling on his food choice.

I skimmed the menu, asked the waiter which he preferred. Ordered his suggestion. Suggested an appetizer to my date, who agreed.

We received bread and a delightful pesto sauce instead of butter for its accomplice.

He double-dipped his bread, consumed most of the sauce.

Rude. First date and double-dipping? First date and consuming more than half the portion out without saying anything and, upon consumption, not immediately asking the wait staff for more?

Appetizer came.

He did not know how to eat it. 31 years old and doesn't know how to eat a steamed artichoke. Attacked it with his knife.

I stopped him, educated him.

It came in two halves. He took the bigger without asking, dumped the decorative garnish on my half so I had to move it.


It wasn't the game that some of the PUAs advocate, hah, I wish. That would've been something to work with. No, it was simply ignorance of social standards.

The meal comes. When the server asks who had what order, I am the one directing.

We eat. He exclaims how delicious his is, offers me a bite. I take a small piece and agree with him.

In turn, of course, I offer him a bite of mine.

He removes a huge piece.


Our waiter comes by to check on things. We exchange more words. My date is silent, not fuming, not awkward, just not participating.

Water is refilled, refilled, refilled. I thank the server each time, move the glass closer when he comes by.

My date orders a harder alcholic beverage. Doesn't ask. Ends up spilling it across the table. Runs over the edge, spills onto me. Makes no attempt to clean up his mess while I dab at my pants.

Conversation lulls, I ask him about his business. Normally I make it a point not to talk about a man's job (mostly out of a delight to torment them with my apparent lack of interest), but I already know what he does. I already know that he is going into meetings about selling his company this week, and it is likely he's going to be a significantly wealthier man in a short period of time.

I don't care, other than the story of how his company started. I find that fascinating. Ideas and creation.

He talks. Doesn't bother to ask me about what I do.

Whatever. It's not exciting, it's just a job.

I just find conversation needs to be balanced out, needs to cycle.

Check comes, waiter again, another brief exchange.

My date picks up the bill. Nice of him.

...but leaves his card and the check outside of the receptacle it was brought in.

I move it. I know I shouldn't, but it's such... gods. Really? You couldn't move your card over two inches so our very friendly, helpful, and attentive server would not have to scramble to slide it off the table or scrape with his fingernails to pick it up, interrupting any conversation we may have and making him feel awkward?

I was in charge the entire meal. I took the time, put forth the effort, to make sure our waiter provided fantastic and friendly service and was attentive. I got us a good table because I befriended the host.

It left me feeling... well, better, because I am comfortable and confident in this setting. I know what I'm doing, I was taught well. But he likely didn't even notice what I was doing, much less realize the value of having a partner who is competent in doing such things.

I miss GV8. I miss that companionship, that confidence. I miss the dual flirting with the waitresses, the innuendos with the waiters, the table full of laughter, the extras, the fun.

My date did not step up. Not only was he unable to interact with the waitstaff and me, but he was completely ignorant of polite dining practices. He let me take control of the situation, not because of what would have been acceptable (him having me make sure everything was fine in order to please him), but because he wasn't comfortable doing it himself, he didn't have the education or the experience, and he wasn't adaptable enough to take my cues.

Did we have sex anyhow?

Yes, we did.

Why not?

Guys do it all the time, sleep with girls they have no interest in.

The argument could be made that I didn't make him work for it, or he wasn't worthy of me "giving myself" to him, as proved by his lack of awareness and social behaviors.

I do not need him to prove to me in social or financial ways that he's desirable.

I did not need the song and dance number.

I saw him, talked to him, determined he was intelligent enough, already knew he was supposed to be very dominant in bed, and I said, "Sure, you'll do."

And he certainly did "do".

I found a man who was willing to crack me across the face, who was strong enough to toss me around, and had wide, wide palms that marked my ass purple. He didn't care if I screamed (which I did), didn't care if I scrambled away from him (he'd just yank me back), and quite happily left my body very sore, parts of me very swollen and tender from the attention and abuse. Riding him, reverse cowgirl, while he used a Hitachi set high on me, keeping me contracting around him, body spasming, gripping him like a fist, to the point where my stomach muscles were still sore the next day. Being ordered to throat him until I gagged, purposefully choking myself, driving my mouth down, bottoming out orally.

It was good. Not the best, not the roughest, but up there.

Sex is... sex.

I don't feel closer to him.
I don't trust him.
I don't respect him, except for the simple respect I accord another human.

If I see him again, I'd rather it simply be for play.

He doesn't measure up for more socialization. It's not going anywhere, nor do I wish it to.

He's not GV8, he's not even close. He's not someone I want by my side, not someone I want representing me.

Does my lack of interest make me odd? I can't imagine connecting value to sex. Making him fight for it, making him leap through obstacles to prove that he's worthy. Worthy of an orgasm? Worthy of my body?

It's just flesh.

What is he supposed to be worthy of, exactly?

What makes my body of higher value than his?

Who is to say that he did not get more out of that encounter, on an emotional level, than I did?

Who is to say he got less?

And who is to tell me that I am now less, because I'd reduced my bedposts to piles of splinters carving out notches of men that aren't what I need, simply what I want?

Note to Self: You need to get over him. You need to accept that you're never going to find another man like him because his experiences are so out there that it's unlikely to ever find that exact combination again. You need to realize that there are other men out there who will compliment you, who will partner you, in different ways, and you now need to let go of the one who couldn't.

Please try.


  1. I'd have had Iced Tea and would have asked how to properly eat an artichoke. I do, however know how to use a wide variety of silverware and can point out the differences between soup spoons, serving spoons and sorbet spoons as well as dinner and salad forks. I even know how to cross my knife and fork to signal I am done with the repast....
    And to be brutally honest I can be rather brutal....

  2. Savage,

    Careful, careful. I may come to think you're too polished.

  3. You know, what I don't get is, if sex is no big deal to you, why the hell did it bother you that GV8 wanted to screw other women?

    I reckon you punish yourself a lot and try to paint it a virtue.

  4. Pathologist,

    I believe there are two reasons for my inability to deal with GV8's need to screw other women.

    1. Basic insecurity. It's fairly obvious how much that plagues me. Fear of not measuring up to his other partners and that he would leave me if one proved better in some way.

    2. This is the main one to me.

    Most people view sex as having value in its own right. Sex is a major thing with a lot of content to it. I find this to be a socially created value, and it does not make sense to me.

    I find value in sex based on the relationship I have with my partner. The deeper the relationship, the more value sex takes.

    So sex has no meaning to me, other than pleasure, unless the person I am with has meaning to me.

    GV8 has significant meaning to me. Therefore, the sex takes on significant value.

    I am monogamous. I am monogamous to the point of if I am partnered up with someone, I basically lose all interest in other males, naturally. There's no fear of me cheating because I simply have no interest in anyone but my partner.

    So, basically, me having sex with a person I love, trust, and respect, takes on the same significance of a woman who does value sex in its own right and only chooses to sleep with a few men with love and commitment connections.

    It makes perfect sense to me, but that's because of how I view sex. Most people don't seem to understand it, even people who see how I interact with the men in my life.

    I'm not understanding how I punish myself, though. Or how I paint my behavior as a virtue.

  5. 1) Yes I knew that you were very insecure, hence not Alpha.

    2) Maybe I'm making too much of this, but one of your posts mentioned how how you loved GV8 for accepting you as you were, particularly how your previous sexual experience was not a turn off for him. To me this implies that this is an anxiety of yours, and hence something you're not deep down particularly proud of.

    A distinction needs to be made though. I think you are proud of your sexual prowess, but I'm not so sure that your that happy with the partner count and your smart enough to realise that for most men, that is an undesirable feature.

    GV8 made you happy because, apart from his other desirable qualities, he didn't care about your past. He looked over your self-percieved blemish. He loved you for who you are.

    Now the next question I asked myself is, TSP why did she have sex with a man she found psychologically repulsive? Possible answers:

    1) She wanted a fuck and couldn't care less who gave it to her.
    objection: She is enourmously self-controlled, intelligent and has some standards. Would she fuck some hobo on the street if she needed her itch scratched? I doubt it. That explanation didn't wash.
    2)She liked the guy. Nope.
    3)She hated herself: The fact a worthy man like GV8 would not commit to her meant, in her mind, that no worthy man would commit to her. She only deserves social retards, and since he was willing she would let him, confirmation of her lack of worth. Yeah, the sex was good, but it was sex with a social retard.

    Explaination (3) seems the most probable. That's where the "punishing myself" idea came from.

    Sex is not something you do alone, sex is a two party arrangement. The other party has got to want to have sex with you. A sexual act is in many ways a validation that you have something desirable, some quality about you that someone wants. Yeah, it is a pleasure activity, but it's pleasurable on two levels:
    2)Emotional. Even the casual fling re-enforces that idea that you are desirable. Even if you're not intersted in the other party. The fact that somebody wants to fuck you means that you have something that is desirable. You're not a total loser. It confirms you have the power of attraction. In many ways your desirability is confirmed by the "quality" of the partner that desires you. That's why when a 10 bangs a 5, the 5 is over the moon.

    I understand your view of sex. On its own it's no big deal.

    I think you actually use men as a means of sexual gratification, because you are in many ways secure of your sexual allure(which will slowly fade). It's easy for you to get laid. You've let men have have sex with you, but you wanted to have sex with GV8. Big psychological difference.

    I think you realise as well that the clock is ticking and not just that; you need more, someone who loves you for who you are, and not what you give. And not only that, you're an aesthete, sexual pleasure is better in the contex of a loving relationship. I imagine that you've tried pretty much every permutation and combination, but nothing compares to having hot sex with a man you love and who loves you back.

    There's no fear of me cheating because I simply have no interest in anyone but my partner.

    Red flag.
    You commitment is conditional on your interest?
    That's bad. I hate to be harsh but to the prudent man you're no long term material. Pure love, is loving even when you're not interested.


  6. I don't consider myself alpha, I consider myself a loner. Other people tend to interpret that, and my social behaviors, as alpha, no matter how much I argue.

    The reason why I loved that GV8 was okay with my sexual experience was not because I did not feel like he was judging me, but because he actually, truly valued it, realized that it made me a better partner to him. It wasn't the validation of my history (and behaviors I will continue to engage in), but more of the thrill of meeting someone who shares the same, rarely found, values I have. It bothers me, not because of the judgement, but because of what I consider ignorance and bias, that men look down on women with high partner counts. I've ranted on this before, I'm sure I'll do so again.

    My partner count... I'm actually fairly apathetic about. Sometimes it works for me, sometimes it works against me. I'd never take it back, and I'd never lie about it.

    1. You'd be correct, I don't allow my sex drive to dictate my behaviors like that.

    2. I actually did like him as a person, I just wouldn't date him. He wasn't socially awkward anywhere else but at the two dining establishments we visited, which I still have no explainations for.

    3. This used to be my MO, when I was about 16, 17. A combination of self-loathing and self-destruction would lead me into the damage through sex. It took a lot of work and control to get me out of that behavior pattern. So I can safely say, having recognized the behavior and symptoms in myself, it wasn't not out of a destructive, damaging need.

    I'm going to continue to hold that I slept with him because I chose to do so. I was not seeking validation (been there, done that, recognize it), nor destruction, not even the fantasy that goes with a one-night stand (and he's since called for more activity, so it's no longer a ONS). Didn't even bother with it.

    As for the confirmation of desirability... hm, probably somewhat. It wasn't overarching. I didn't need him to want me. I didn't even want to go out with him that day, and was fairly apathetic if anything happened.

    Thanks for the reminder of my fading allure. This is where I am sticking my tongue out at you.

    That was a good point, about the letting and the wanting in regards to sex. I'm going to have to think about that a lot more.

    I do need and want a man who loves me for me, not for what I am able to do. That'd be lovely. Sex with trust is amazing, and it's something that I would love to explore more.

    RE: red flag... that was not what I meant.

    I did not mean sexual interest, or romantic interest. I've certainly ended up in relationships were the romance dwindles to nothing and the sex is non-existent and had no urge to stray.

    I want to be partnered. I want that union, the teamwork, the building together. When I'm in a relationship, I am so interested in my partner and myself and what we do on all levels, and on making that relationship everything it can be, and our future everything it can be, caring for each other, that other men no longer show up on my radar because my need to be partnered is fulfilled. With or without romance, with or without sex, I'm with that person on every level I can be.

    Probably should have defined "interest".

  7. I don't consider myself alpha, I consider myself a loner. Other people tend to interpret that, and my social behaviors, as alpha, no matter how much I argue.

    I didn't think you were Alpha. And yes I do think you're a loner. I do think that your a strong willed, intelligent woman with a past history of extremely poor judgment(but which is improving with time). You do give the impression of Alpha, but only to those who look at you superficially.

    I don't think that you are bothered by your partner count at all, though I think what bothers you is what your potential partners think about your partner count; and the possibility that you will be disqualified because of it. And no, a lot of it is not just ignorance and bias. But that's for another discussion. GV8's not only accepted you for who you were but embraced your past experience.

    I do think you like Restaurant Retard(RR) as a person, but you let him have sex with you, the payoff being the psychological desirability/validation of self. I think your feeling pretty down on yourself and the sex may have made you feel wanted for a while at least.
    Still, I don't think you wanted to sleep with him. And from reading your post today, I really got the impression that he pushed none of your psychological buttons. You let him have you.

    And what's with all the self hate in today's post?

    Thanks for the reminder of my fading allure. This is where I am sticking my tongue out at you.

    I didn't mean to be insulting, but I was perhaps, undiplomatic.

  8. I think that I have the potential to be Alpha, if I could simply conquer my anxieties and fears. I know how to mime the behaviors, I know how to convince others... I just don't feel it for myself, at my core. Work in progress. I have faith in myself to get there.

    I'm not sure if I'm worried about the disqualification by my potential partners (it's actually nice, because it allows me to weed out the undesirables, a sort of shit test), as much as wondering if I'm going to be able to find a partner who works with me, like GV8. What you posted on a few days ago... if women date up, and we shift that to experience, if we date men more experienced than ourselves, the more experienced a woman, the more limited her pool of partners is. I don't want to be partnered with a man with less experience than I have. That is one of my major worries, that I'll rarely come across those who suit me sexually.

    Oh, RR pushed some of my psych buttons. Just not over dinner. He's an incredibly educated man, and I like that. Being out with him was being filled with information on so many different things... and being able to discuss social/sexual issues, also nice. Mentally, I wanted him, I approved of him. Socially, not as much. Sexually, very much so. But, yes, I did let him have me.

    The self-hate... I have incredibly high standards for myself. Ridiculously high. Probably because I know I'm smart, because I know I'm capable of being healthier and better off than I am now, and it irks me that I am not.

    As for yesterday's post, one of my expectations of myself is that I keep my insecurities and anxieties internal, that I don't allow them to affect others. That post, that letter, was a bleeding out of those anxieties, and I did not even realize it until after I posted it. I'm supposed to be on top of myself, analyzing behaviors before I engage in them, and I did not do so. I violated two expectations of myself and that really bothered me. It let me realize how much the split with GV8 hurt me, and how good I've become at swallowing it down and just letting that hurt come out of me in other ways, and not monitoring my internal state. I'm running away from the pain like a coward, not addressing it, not experiencing it. Makes me feel like I've learned nothing.

    Undiplomatic happens, senor.

    I really appreciate your comments, by the by. You're looking at things from another angle, which is enabling me to do so as well. It's very helpful.

  9. What do you mean running away from pain like a coward? From my side of the screen you look like you've had an unhealthy obsession with embracing it.